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One frog in a group getting fat
#1
So generally my three auratus are doing very well, all three spend a lot of time moving around and hunting and stuff and they're all growing and developing nice muscles.

My concern is that one out of the three, definitely the most active hunter, is putting on a bit more weight than the others. I've seen pictures of frogs considered "obese" and it's not that bad -- plus it's still a froglet and has growing to do -- but I wanted to nip a potential problem in the bud. Considering it gets the most exercise it must really be eating a lot, but also may be related to the fact that I put down leaf litter and they all love it, and no one's climbing high into the canopy to poop anymore.

If the other two are hunting and eating and look fine, and the one seems to be getting a bit tubby, how do you control for this in a vivarium? Feed lighter? Skip a few feedings? Switch to every other day? Will this slim down Fatty without interfering with the other two?

I'll try to get a good picture up at some point. One of the other two has gotten a little skittish about me, so I'm going to wait on taking more photos for now.

Thanks.
A girl named Joey.
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#2
Try and take a couple pics - really helpful. Almost all of us overfeed our animals, so nothing uncommon there. I would cut back on everyone's intake a bit. Easy first step.
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#3
Thanks, Phil. I think I'll skip today's feeding (they may be munching on springs anyway). Tonight when the froggies are asleep I'm reseeding the viv with more springs from a good culture, and I'll be throwing in a bunch of flies to discourage too much spring munching on the first day. I'll try to get pics tomorrow when I mist the viv and everyone's too excited about the FF activity to be bothered by me.
A girl named Joey.
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#4
another thing you can do, is discontinue the springtail seedings.

I only recommend lots and lots of springtails for the smaller frogs and obligate froglets ect. Large sized adult frogs need to be eating lots of dusted feeder insects - how they get their vitamins and nutrients, calcium ect.
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#5
I'm mainly trying to get the viv seeded with springtails for their janitorial properties. As a food source they're secondary; I do feed dusted FFs almost every day. I'm culturing my own on NE HERP's media now. Which might be part of my problem as they're booming like mad, so I have been feeding a bit heavy. There aren't flies crawling around the next day, or maybe just a couple, but I can still cut back as you suggest.

Here's a couple of snaps I just got, since everybody is quite social today. This is Splotch: he's recently developed that pot belly. (Sorry for the poor quality but I wanted to grab him while the angle was good.)

[Image: be4uhe7a.jpg]

And here's Four-spot, my other "biggie" for comparison, with smaller Three-spot photobombing.

[Image: y8uru9y6.jpg]

Off-topic, do these look more like green-and-black or green-and-bronze to you? The dark markings look very black to me, but the minty green color looks like the bronzes do.
A girl named Joey.
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#6
Look like smaller round females..as females getting 'hippy-er" (No offense). They don't look obese to me. Gular fat deposits are a pretty good bellwether for fattiness on that species. I'd cut back a little either way.

YOU may feel the springs are primarily for tank janitor duties but I'm 100% positive Splotch and the gang feel....otherwise.

Springtails = little debbies

or

'Git in mah belly'
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#7
LOL, true, that was an anthropocentric not a herpetocentric (?) view of the springtails' role.

Very good to know about the gular fat deposits. I'll definitely keep an eye on that. Thanks for your eye on the frogs. I do think Splotch & Four are females and smaller, narrower-backed Three is a male, so what you say makes sense to me. (And no offense taken!) These being my first I'm not familiar yet with what stages the froglets' bodies go through as they grow so I'm glad to hear they're good. I'll still cut back a little as you suggest.

Thanks again!
A girl named Joey.
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#8
Philsuma Wrote:another thing you can do, is discontinue the springtail seedings.

I only recommend lots and lots of springtails for the smaller frogs and obligate froglets ect. Large sized adult frogs need to be eating lots of dusted feeder insects - how they get their vitamins and nutrients, calcium ect.

Springtails are nature's calcium niblettes. There's no down side to having them ( tons and tons) in-viv.

Darts do not by any means need to be fed every day. The simple answer (after we view a few pics) is to not feed so many FFs, if obesity is creeping in.
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


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#9
Very true on the Calcium niblettes, but that assumes the springs have access to a decent amount of calcium, a la the new wave of clay substrates ect. A ton of people are not using eggshell and are culturing their springtails on nothing but yeast. I don't know how much calcium they are getting from just yeast.

I like being able to regulate or at least try...the amounts and types of vitamins and other superfine supplements and there are only a couple people that I've seen 'dust' their springs effectively.

As long as the frogs are taking enough dusted flies, I guess.
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#10
Joey, I breed El Cope auratus which are a locale of "turquoise and bronze". Initially the spots start out as black on the morphlets and as the frogs mature they change to a antique bronze color.
Jon
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#11
Philsuma Wrote:Very true on the Calcium niblettes, but that assumes the springs have access to a decent amount of calcium, a la the new wave of clay substrates ect. A ton of people are not using eggshell and are culturing their springtails on nothing but yeast. I don't know how much calcium they are getting from just yeast.

I like being able to regulate or at least try...the amounts and types of vitamins and other superfine supplements and there are only a couple people that I've seen 'dust' their springs effectively.

As long as the frogs are taking enough dusted flies, I guess.

Yeast cells uptake calcium from their environment, as do springs, rather quickly. I feed mainly yeast to my springs.
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.

My new email address is: rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476
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#12
The frogs suck down dusted flies like every one might be their last. (I'm rotating Repashy and pink/blue currently.) I'm starting out feeding the springs only yeast; depending on how that goes I may or may not add other foods. Dusted flies are definitely the frogs' main staple though.

The FedEx guy left a charcoal springtail culture, emblazoned with PERISHABLE and THIS WAY UP stickers, on its side on my porch. I had to laugh as I called to complain, and Three-spot came way up to the front of the viv and watched me on the bed. He does this from time to time but I like to think he was cheering me on this time.

[Image: pyrezupe.jpg]
A girl named Joey.
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