Where have these pumilio gone?

[rcteem]

Over the years of being in the hobby it seems several pumilio are becoming harder and harder to find. Here is my list and feel free to correct me if Im wrong.


"Cayo de Aquas"
"Solarte/ "Cayo Nancy"
"Loma Partida"
"Colons"
"Isla popa"

Please feel free to correct me if Im wrong or add any that I may have forgotten to the list. Again, this list is for pumilio that used to be common and now are hard to find!!! Not pumilio that have always been rare

[rcteem]

This a good start off species in the pumilio family we need to try to save and have long term plans for like Michael was stating in some of his post.

[Philsuma]

ALL pumilio can go this route and disappear. it's entirely possible.....your list can one day even include Eldorados, Chris.

Guarumos - not common
Rio Branos - not common either

I know less than 10 people total, who have ANY of those morphs that you have listed.

[rcteem]

Have the Rio Branos and Guarumos ever been common?

[Philsuma]

I don't think any pumilio import has been considered "common".

Seems like a lot of blue jean look-alike ,i.e Almirante, man creek have come in, but again.....wait a few years and even these will be hard to find.

The real question is: What percentage of the imports die right away (within 4 months or so, as an example) ?

[RichFrye]

Over the years of being in the hobby it seems several pumilio are becoming harder and harder to find. Here is my list and feel free to correct me if Im wrong.


"Cayo de Aquas"
"Solarte/ "Cayo Nancy"
"Loma Partida"
"Colons"
"Isla popa"

Please feel free to correct me if Im wrong or add any that I may have forgotten to the list. Again, this list is for pumilio that used to be common and now are hard to find!!! Not pumilio that have always been rare

None of the above listed have ever been considered common, ever. Name ten people who have bred these well and kept these each in the past and I'll shoot you a free pair .
A tangent from the DB thread, the VAST majority of 'rio branco' and 'rio gauramo' were only sight IDed , not proven at all to be actual locales. I know of exactly one line of real, verified Gauramos, period. One.
Bastis used to be the most eastablished, now it may be any line of best guess almicreeks or doradodos, but there have never been any one locale which is firmly entranched and established at all.

That said, I am always interested in 100% proven site locale obligates. If you have provable locale obligates and wish to trade for other 100% proven loclaes, please email me @
richfrye@comcast.net

Anyone wishing to get real , factual info on the situation with these ( any 'morph') Panama pumilio imported in the last 7-8 years, please also email me for my phone number to talk.

Rich

[blocker institute]

Is it possible for you (Rich Frye or anybody) to provide an example of what "papers" look like? While somewhat "green" to this hobby I have never seen a person pull out a "sheet" to prove to another person where a locale is from. Within said sheet, what sort of "red flags" does one look for and what to avoid?

Seeing as to how we plan on being in the hobby for awhile, I'd like to obtain as much valuable information as possible.

Thanks

Jason

[Philsuma]

I think your'e going to hear crickets on this one, Jason.......don't hold your breath.

[guppygal]

I think your'e going to hear crickets on this one, Jason.......don't hold your breath.

No kidding. This is one of those debates that's been going on since we were all on Kingsnake. I always figured that the 'main' breeders would come up with a stud registry of sorts to keep track of the lineage. It works for horses, dogs, cats - why not frogs? Well, I don't think there will ever be a Westminster Abby Frog Show, I guess ~

[blocker institute]

I'm unclear as to what I'm holding my breath for. Is there nobody that has an example of these sheets? I'll give it a little more time and see what comes forward. I can't possibly imagine that they don't exist.

I'll check some research journals at the library or other reference guides.

Thanks

Jason

[RichFrye]

When a person imports a frog, that specific person gets paperwork with that specific frog. A one time deal, period. When I start exporting and importing I'll gladly show any and all paperwork on request.

It has been made clear to me from reading the owner and one specific moderator here that I am way too abrasive for posting on forums (barring "For Sale") so I will leave it at this and respect the wishes of those two.
Goodbye.

[blocker institute]

I think that's great information. Well that sucks about not posting here. Maybe you'll read this and PM me. Where does the information go from there?

After the discovery is made and all the recording is done, is it given to another board of some sort, or to wildlife folks? I'm learning as I go so any help is appreciated? Just pointing in a positive direction works for us. I may be asking something that others are curious to know too. Or not. My knowledge will only increase with those around helping.

Thanks.

Jason

[Philsuma]

If you hear anything further on this subject Jason...please post up.

Thanks.

[Roadrunner]

When you bring frogs into the country you get paperwork, stamped by f&w. When you sell frogs, you give out receipts. That receipt shows that you purchased frogs and the paperwork stays w/ the importer on file and it's logged into a database for everything that was imported/exported each year. If you get a shipment date the import can be looked up on the computer. There is no paperwork that accompanies the frogs as all the frogs imported were on that paperwork and you only bought a few. Cites paperwork is not supposed to be copied and handed out. You only get a receipt as proof you bought the frogs from so and so.

[blocker institute]

When you bring frogs into the country you get paperwork, stamped by f&w. When you sell frogs, you give out receipts. That receipt shows that you purchased frogs and the paperwork stays w/ the importer on file and it's logged into a database for everything that was imported/exported each year. If you get a shipment date the import can be looked up on the computer. There is no paperwork that accompanies the frogs as all the frogs imported were on that paperwork and you only bought a few. Cites paperwork is not supposed to be copied and handed out. You only get a receipt as proof you bought the frogs from so and so.

Great Info! How does somebody access such information for educating themselves?

[Roadrunner]

I'm not sure, you only need it if your shipping frogs to another country. I'm not sure if the general public can access it or if only F&W can access it to issue cites papers. If you wanted to make sure someone actually brought frogs in legally you could probably ask them to see their paperwork.