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what is a good Dart Frog to start with ?
#1
hello, i'm new to pdf's and i'm wondering whats a good starting frog?

i've read a few other topics about good starting frogs, but different people differ in setups etc so not each is the best for everybody Tongue

anyway, i'm in the process of building a huge viv. not including substrate area, the actual living space for any critters in it will be 6ft long x 2ft deep x almost 3ft high. it will have a 2ft mountain on one side with a waterfall going into a stream that runs to the opposite end of the tank where thier will be a 3-5 gallon pond. i'm going to be trying to immitate a natural rainforest habitat with it.

was going to go with geckos at first, but pdfs are much prettier and i like frogs more.

i've read thier all territorial, but some not as much as others. i would also like to keep multiple closely related sub-species if possible to provide plenty of color variation.
so...with the tank so large, whats a good species that can be kept in it?
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#2
How much money do you want to spend on the frogs? I would highly recommend D. galactonotus--the orange splash backs or other orange forms for a tank this size. They do very well in large groups, even better than in pairs, or smaller groups and are very bold and active. They are not cheap, however, as they have not yet attained the popularity and breeding numbers of D. leucomelas.

While they will climb around a lot and even utilize bromeliads for sitting in and resting, as they get older, they become more terrestrially oriented. I've had mine for 6 years now in a 135 gallon paludarium, and still find them fascinating to watch.
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#3
that sounds amazing. thats what im wondering if i should do in my 65 gallon. if it looks good and u get me jealous enough i might just do that instead of setting it up with fresh water fish.
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#4
Thats actually what I plan on doing with my newly setup viv. But I have to wait for tax returns to come in... -sigh- one more month.

Ill probaly get orange, but maybe Ill get the red galacts. Thatd be amazing...
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#5
The red Galact morphs are not as bold and "intelligent" from what Patrick has told me in the past. I haven't had peronal experience with them--yet. These orange guys are mostly about "personality." As for color, I do have a personal preference for red frogs, since they are more unusual, and I just like the color red, but if tit comes to tat, I'll opt for the entertainers any time. They are the only darts I have that will actually line up and seem to watch activity going on outside of the tank. That's why I used the word "intelligent," as curiosity is one sign of it, although this doesn't seem to be a good survival trait in the wild.

With a plaudarium, you can have fresh water fish, too, albeit small ones.
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#6
The red galcs do have a tendancy to be a little more reclusive than the orange.
The yellows are fairly bold, but I would say the orange and blacks, wouuld rival the luecomelas as for visablity.

Cindy Dicken
Vivarium Concepts
www.vivariumconcepts.com
www.rainforesthabitats.com
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#7
wonder how a mix of red, yellow, and orange would look in the tank.

for the pond, i was planning on putting some neon tetras in it. they don't get much larger then an inch so woulden't harm anything except fruit flies that fall in the water. don't know if they'd be too small to eat tadpoles if the frogs bred in the large viv without me noticing and moving the eggs to a smaller tank for hatching.
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#8
Zaroba, one of each color would make for a striking display, however we get in to the issue of cross breeding, and let's not go there. You can do a search on mixing species and see what I mean.

Neon tetras would be fine in the water portion of the tank. If and when the time comes that you would have tadpoles in the water portion, it is doubtful, the neons would bother them.

Cindy Dicken
Vivarium Concepts
www.vivariumconcepts.com
www.rainforesthabitats.com
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#9
I agree with Cindy. Other than the cross breeding problem, it might also spoil the way a group of one particular morph such as the splash-backs, get along so well together and relate to each other. The red might be overly intimidated by the bolder frogs, and you might never see it. I'd just make a choice and stick with one morph. While what you do on your own is your business, cross breeding morphs that may eventually go on the market to other hobbyists is generally regarded as unethical.

I would go with one morph at a time in separate tanks at first. When you learn about them individually first hand, then you can consider a mixed display tank in which you would of course pull all eggs. But don't start out mixing. 12 dart frog vivariums later, I no longer consider mixing them, although this was what I too, wanted to do when I first started out.
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