Stu & Shaz's Dart Frog Room

[Stu&Shaz]

A little dodge,woodlice you call 'em isos,well they take a while to really get going,so it occurred to me a little while back while I'm building...erm huge stocks i guess, of the dwarf white, good stocks of the fastgrey from Peru and getting going with the giant orange, that there might be a really quick way of getting a stock of little isos together for feeders.
We use wild food principally from our garden which has been organic for ages, so i put together our normal iso mix,leaflitter/rotton plum wood/bit of charcoal,popped the mix in a microwave for a few seconds to kill off any competion and them popped that in our 3l containers which are ventilated

topped this of with some cardboard great tip Phil, and then scoured the garden for isos,particular attention being paid to collecting adults especially with eggs underneath,i caught maybe 1/200 in an hour. these went in the tub and we put this in the coolest place in the frogroom.In 2 weeks i had literally hundreds of little baby white isos to feed to our frogs



now we are about a month or so on theis culture is rammed with kids for the frogs.
our biggest challenge is harvesting,the card works ok especially when baited with fishflake but we have also utilised a pooter for collection,ha don't forget a bit of gauze under the lid to stop you sucking up stuff...lmao..not good!!!!!



ha we grow some mean grub too,'excuse the onions rushing :lol:
kerching
Stu

[Convertible]

Again, you're unbelievable crafty as I see, those ideas with the tadpoles and the woodlice are ace! I'm Marcel by the way, 27, and nice to meet you!

I think those ideas of your's and your work is quite an inspiration for all those who are new to the hobby, or even people who are doing this since some time.

[Stu&Shaz]

Again, you're unbelievable crafty as I see, those ideas with the tadpoles and the woodlice are ace! I'm Marcel by the way, 27, and nice to meet you!

I think those ideas of yours and your work is quite an inspiration for all those who are new to the hobby, or even people who are doing this since some time.

Hey Marcel,i dunno mate about the inspiring it is said but I'll take the crafty 8) :lol: :lol: :lol: just wanna chuck back stuff for the kindness given to us by guys in this hobby,it must always be remembered that we are beginners though Marcel so these are ideas!!! as yet without real substance...very important that !
good to meet you too mate
Stu

[Stu&Shaz]

Well i have had to stop on the boxes front,as i have run out of glass for the moment,there will be more later i guess,once i cut the doors for our next couple of vivs,off cuts will go for this project,but hopefully twenty odd at once will not have to happen too often ,hmm maybe,it will, if the eggs start hatching well

.
4 little mystie tads hatched today

Now on the subject of these i have been doing some digging lately about these,here in the uk. I am very fortunate to be able to speak to a pro at one of our most estimeed zoological societies occassionally. All our frogs get uvb,but it appears that mysetiosus might need more than other dart frogs,some guys over here are struggling to morph out their frogs, also i have come across cases of oedema,and metabolic bone disease all seem to be linked to Ca uptake D3 and uvb,at least my mate thinks so and her vet!!. Fortunately kinda following hunches and reading,we even have uvb over our tads, i have no idea what the outcome for us and our frogs will be yet beginners huh,but i'll some how have to sort out something on this tad system aswell as our little brood increaes. our mystie hatch rate is very good so far,so we are really chuffed,the auratus tads are still poor although of course they are much younger frogs,and having 2 females now laying ...one i believe stared laying much later it is really difficult to know exactly which eggs are which. That said we have a clutch drawing towards hatch date that looks good so fingers crossed

As a guy that has spent years incubating bird eggs,with pretty good results,even using real primative gear,i am really frustrated by this,although hopefully it is just the young frog thing and nothing we are doing, time will tell.
On the subject of tads morhing out our first dart tad is very close to popping its front legs,i so hope the dreaded don't happen,we will both be gutted if it does here's him affectionately called " Ickle mate"



So do any of you more experianced folks think he looks ok? i have read the sls tads have a particulr shape...is this true?
Take care all
oh nearly forgot
ahh bless

Stu

[Philsuma]

Looks good to me, Stu. I don't know anyone that can predict SLS by way of body shape ect.

[Stu&Shaz]

Looks good to me, Stu. I don't know anyone that can predict SLS by way of body shape ect.

Cheers mate,we'll just have to be patient,read somewhere about snow man body shape??? lets hope for 2 big strong front legs eh!!
Stu

[Cindy Dicken]

Looks good to me, Stu. I don't know anyone that can predict SLS by way of body shape ect. The only way to tell is after both fronts pop.

Cheers mate,we'll just have to be patient,read somewhere about snow man body shape??? lets hope for 2 big strong front legs eh!!
Stu

That late stage tadpole looks fine.
A lot of times with severe SLS, you will notice a distinct figure 8 shape (or snowman as you called it) to the body in the later stages.
I think I have a picture of one, I will see if I can locate it and post it.

[Stu&Shaz]

Looks good to me, Stu. I don't know anyone that can predict SLS by way of body shape ect. The only way to tell is after both fronts pop.

Cheers mate,we'll just have to be patient,read somewhere about snow man body shape??? lets hope for 2 big strong front legs eh!!
Stu

That late stage tadpole looks fine.
A lot of times with severe SLS, you will notice a distinct figure 8 shape (or snowman as you called it) to the body in the later stages.
I think I have a picture of one, I will see if I can locate it and post it.

That would be wonderful Cindy,a photo would be fantastic, i read so much and we are so obsessed that i often doubt that i remember stuff correctly,especially on the net because i can't always remember where i sourced said info :oops: .
If our first little chap is healthy and we get so rear him i ...sorry WE, will be so happy.I have dreaded seeing this right from when we first came across it. We have kinda chucked everything we have been able to reserch into avoiding this in our tadpols,diet vairied,and including live wild food, lighting(uvb),and same with adults to get the best quality of egg to start with,but the auratus are young so we are still worried that it might not be enough.
Thanks Cindy much appreciated
regards
Stu

[Stu&Shaz]

Tad rearing gizmo,complete. water circulation worries are unfounded,although i still have concearns that are slight over the mesh size used which might be too small,and also the tray which bothers me,knowing me i could well end up making a glass version but will carefully monitor progress while we find out how it all goes
complete gizmo plus pump/filter

here's a detail of the tray and boxes

and one of natures greatest wonders,a little tad nearly a little dartfrog and super special because its our very first and Shaz aint seen this before in the flesh,kinda the culmination of 2 yrs hard graft in a way
Ickle mate nearly there ,we better rear him,we'll be so gutted if we don't,can't believe we have got this far really,purdy huh

bring it on
Stu

[Convertible]

Stu, I cannot but repeat myself. You are a genius! Everything you touch seems to become gold. If I ever travel to UK, I'll have to visit the Stonehenge and You!

[Stu&Shaz]

Stu, I cannot but repeat myself. You are a genius! Everything you touch seems to become gold. If I ever travel to UK, I'll have to visit the Stonehenge and You!

Marcel you are really kind,and of course your welcome to come and see us, if you ever get to England. But let us see if it works my friend,before i am congratulated,there might be problems we don't know of yet. If any of you more knowledgeable folks see any issues with the above contraption please don't hesitate to advise me.I relish constructive critism your thoughts are always welcome here.
We are now watching to see what temperatures it runs at we might have to install a small aquarium heater to bring it up a couple of degrees,
thanks again mate
Stu

[Stu&Shaz]

Every now and then there is one of those unbelievably special moments in a beginner dartsters journey,ya know first frogs, first call,first eggs that actually hatch,into your first tadpol,a week ago thursday our very first tad affectionately called Ickle mate popped a couple of front legs,the changes that followed the following week have filled me with wonder since childhood and always will. Only this time is really special as its a dart,so there are the colours as well.
Here he is on wed,seriously thinking on whether outside is really that good

We had lovingly prepared him a gently sloping pond with a bit of moss for easy exit,but he was having none of it,on thursday he just climbed out over the side,ahh man the relief of good legs.
So here's our very first tadpol,and now our very first froglet,super cool superblue auratus,we haven't done it yet of course still got to rear him,but we're on the way.

Many more will follow i guess over the years that we are setting ourselves up for,but this little guy will always be special,hope we do right by him!! We haven't seen him feed yet when we actually do whitness it ,We will be more relaxed,but at the same time we're giving him his space,trying to keep stress to a minimum. Simply put....STOKED!!!
So we like auratus,we are already on another viv for a group of 5,this will live alongside the panama specails that are already in residence. Having watched the behaviour of our auratus we are trying to give them a viv where they feel secure with plenty of hiding at the back,but also hiding spots that are visable to us.Our take on this for this underway viv is a pile of rocks,fake as ever,due to weight concearns and cause i kinda like the challenge of making stuff.
The rocks were carved out of polystyrene,i spared no expense on tools for this and utilised a broken hacksaw blade with a bit of tape wrapped around the handle :lol: ,also a vacume is quite useful :roll: Once the carving is sorted,i run over the poly. with a heat gun,DO THIS OUTSIDE...fumes!!!
Here's some pics,so you get an idea of where this is heading



aproximately the viewing angle

and a random bit of detail

the next step is to cover the rocks in rockoflex,a grounding product made by ENT in germany,its already sorted but i haven't had chance to sort pics yet. the final coat is epoxyresin,which is covered in pigmented rockdust while wet.
Again no pics but i have also rigged up a lighting bracket for the tad rearing system,as i want to have uvb over the tads during developement,we have our first resident,i am going slowly to see how everything works.
belucky guys
Stu

[Stu&Shaz]

Here's the rocks with erm some rockoflex on them :lol:

and a couple of shots of the completed tad gizmo


regards
Stu

[Philsuma]

Looks excellent Stu....thanks so much for posting ! Great pics as well.

[Stu&Shaz]

Looks excellent Stu....thanks so much for posting ! Great pics as well.

Thanks kiddo,its my pleasure to post here,I have received much back. I wish i knew whether the tad thing was going to work out ok mate,little guy in there looks fine,couple of days now,i fed him some live wild grub last night.Phil its a sight to see they attack stuff like little sharks and shake the hell out of it. They are really voracious little predators when given the chance!
The mesh i have used might well be too small,BUT, there is a side benefit,in that the mesh is regulating the flow of water. As these tadpoles are still water animals,i have harboured concerns about this for a while with using such a powerful filter. Its is circulating the tads water though just a very gentle "drift" to the tad. Waste is accumulating at one end,the mesh possibly wont let it escape i might have to hand syphon,but that's still going to be very easy to accomplish. It also means that the live food can't escape,so abit swings and roundabouts...gain abit and lose abit. The little froglet seems ok ,i haven't witnessed feeding yet but it looks like he has awful belly and my god doesn't he have a turn of speed,leg worries are definitely unfounded!
regards
Stu

[Stu&Shaz]

Here are a few shots of some of our little sharks munching some wild grub,this is only part of their diet they also get algae,cyclops EEZE tetra min and graze a bit of oakleaf.




regards
Stu

[nrf]

Wonderful thread Stu!
I look forward to each update! Keep up the great work!

[Stu&Shaz]

Wonderful thread Stu!
I look forward to each update! Keep up the great work!

Thanks Richie, i feel we're just about keeping up with the frogs at the moment,as fast as one lot start to hatch another lot get laid,and as the auratus get more mature so their hatches are improving,its a bit of a shock,a cool one though. Ahh man the little spotty guys were courting all afternoon and evening today,fabulous,round and round they went inspecting everyfilm can top to bottom of the viv,him leading her,jumping from one rock,turning round calling her,then when she caught up ,the stroking starts and his stamping,then off again...superb. Eggs by morning i guess.
Got the rocks all epoxied and dusted but it started raining,then the light was gone, so pics tomorrow before all the dust comes off,and then once its all dry a good wash and scrub and we'll see what they look like.
cheers for the kind words Richie much appreciated
regards
Stu

[Stu&Shaz]

not terribly happy with the rocks ,others are but me.... nah!!!i need a greater array of pigments,if i could use paint on them,it would be a walk in the park,these are pre wash an scrub,am well on the way to having,them in the viv now but again ran out of light ,so catch up tomorrow plus cork is sorted. My biggest mistake was not having quite enough pigment in the dust,its a difficult thing to call because the pigment in the epoxy bleeds into the dust,so one is kind of working blind as the results are not clear untill after washing.For sure we are getting closer,i guess if i was making them more often then i could get very close,its a bit frustrating beause i feel i so nearly have them believable,they are close enough to fool someone occassionally,but i want to fool all the people all the time :lol:


take care ya'll
Stu

[Stu&Shaz]

and the viv a bit furthur on

its actually finished as far as the background goes,pics soon.
thought it would be fun to have a look around where we are now and see some of the vivs
so the racks look like this



the auratus viv will live top left
and our vivs as they stand today























and finally while i'm plucking up the courage to get the tad gizmo working with avengance the little guys are in residence here,the covered tubs have eggs in.Stayed on it last night, till 1pm, splitting an auratus hatch as they hatched,as our auratus are so young this seems to be manifesting itself as tads dying at or very very soon after hatch point,progressively the hatches are getting better,but if one dies then overnight it seems to taint the water killing others,so split them as soon as possible has become our method. Yup one did die eary but this time took no others and tonight i have 5 little guys swimming around,so am really chuffed.Mystie hatch rate is way better as these are older frogs i guess. Apart from these very early losses we have lost no others,hope i haven't cursed us with that

belucky guys 'im off to make some music,got a couple of songs we need to tweak the mix on
regards
Stu