Pea Aphids - Anyone using them ?

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RichFrye
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Pea Aphids - Anyone using them ?

Postby RichFrye » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:03 am

If anybody is culturing these , I'd like to get into trying these as feeders.
Looking for 200-300 aphids and any personal experiences.

Thanks,
Rich
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


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Postby Dancing frogs » Tue Apr 13, 2010 1:43 pm

I'll let you know Rich...I just started sprouting some beans and peas...going to let them grow for a week or so before I order my starter aphids from http://www.berkshirebiological.com/record0019.html
Brian T. Sexton

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Postby RichFrye » Tue Apr 13, 2010 6:18 pm

Cool Brian,
Let me know how they do.

Rich
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.

My new email address is rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476

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Postby Dancing frogs » Thu Apr 15, 2010 12:17 pm

I'm going to order my starter next week.
I started by sprouting both some fancy fava bean seeds, and some black-eyed peas (had them anyway, for bean beetle culture).
The fava beans, which were way more expensive than the black-eyed peas, are taking way longer to sprout, and much more succeptable to mold.

I took a 190oz container, put some coco-fiber in the bottom, and planted one half with the favas and the other with the peas.
Going to see which the aphids prefer...if that is equal, I'll probably stick with the black eyed peas, as I don't have to order them, they are cheaper, faster, and don't have mold problems...
That's all for now.
Brian T. Sexton

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Postby gary1218 » Thu Apr 15, 2010 3:20 pm

I was one of the few people that got into culturing these when it was posted on the other board several months ago. I found it interesting and fun to do, but in the end not really worth the effort. Plus, it was hit or miss if the frogs decided they were a food scource. Might work if froglets were started right off onto the aphids as a first food scource.

The key is getting the timing down on planting the seeds. The aphids will be feeding on a group of the pea/bean sprouts. As the aphids eat up that group of sprouts you have to have another group of new sprouts to transfer them on to to keep the cycle going. If the timing wasn't just right you would get a die off.

A few people were trying a different food scource so you wouldn't have to be planting new seeds at a scheduled time all the time. But, nobody ever posted anything that they found to work.

They were cute little buggers though :)
GARY

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Postby gary1218 » Thu Apr 15, 2010 3:25 pm

few pics of what I tried.
Image
Image
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GARY

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Postby RichFrye » Thu Apr 15, 2010 3:26 pm

gary1218 wrote:I was one of the few people that got into culturing these when it was posted on the other board several months ago. I found it interesting and fun to do, but in the end not really worth the effort. Plus, it was hit or miss if the frogs decided they were a food scource. Might work if froglets were started right off onto the aphids as a first food scource.

The key is getting the timing down on planting the seeds. The aphids will be feeding on a group of the pea/bean sprouts. As the aphids eat up that group of sprouts you have to have another group of new sprouts to transfer them on to to keep the cycle going. If the timing wasn't just right you would get a die off.

A few people were trying a different food scource so you wouldn't have to be planting new seeds at a scheduled time all the time. But, nobody ever posted anything that they found to work.

They were cute little buggers though :)


Gary,
What was the smallest frog that would take them? I'm looking for something to supplement sprintails as I have lots of young pums hopping around.

Thanks,
Rich
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.

My new email address is rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476

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Postby gary1218 » Thu Apr 15, 2010 3:31 pm

I don't think I see them as a replacement for springtails Rich. They're bigger than that. Kind of on par in size to melos.

I don't think I tried them with any of my thumb froglets, just the adults.
GARY

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Postby RichFrye » Thu Apr 15, 2010 3:42 pm

gary1218 wrote:I don't think I see them as a replacement for springtails Rich. They're bigger than that. Kind of on par in size to melos.

I don't think I tried them with any of my thumb froglets, just the adults.


Well, if they are not feedable to my young pums I may have to bail on the idea. More work for stuff the darts don't go after tenaciously does not seem to work for me.
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.

My new email address is rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476

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Postby Dancing frogs » Fri Apr 30, 2010 4:16 pm

I got my starters today...I can see why the frogs don't necessarily go crazy for them...they don't really move unless dislodged from the plants, so just taking the plants/culture and putting it in the viv probably won't work too well...when it comes time for me to try feeding them out, I'll probably either brush them from the plants or try using a sifter.
One of the people adding to the post on the other board says they like to sift them, and that allows separating sizes for different frogs...
Brian T. Sexton

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Postby gary1218 » Fri Apr 30, 2010 4:22 pm

Brian,

I'd be VERY interested in knowing how you end up doing with them. Send me a PM if you have the time.
GARY

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Postby Dancing frogs » Fri May 07, 2010 2:52 am

Tried some on my brazillian yellowheads...they seemed to like them.
I suggest anyone who tries these take some time getting used to pea cuturing first.
I thought I had it down well enough, but the aphids seem to grow/multiply way faster than the peas will grow. I had about 3 weeks of sprouts started (been starting new ones every friday), and the starter hosts look almost toast, and the ones I had started don't have much food on them yet.
They much prefer the fava bean plants vs the black eyed peas...though a couple have migrated to the nearby black eyed pea plants.
I'd suggest you get some fava beans started with at least 3 internodes before getting a starter culture.
I tried using spagnum moss as a substrate, as I thought I remember reading it had anti fungal properties, and fungus is the main problem I am having with getting the bean growing down.
Tried coco brick and it seems to work way better. (less mold issues)
The bean plants/sprouts also seem to like warmer temps than your average frogroom. A heat mat might help.
Brian T. Sexton

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Postby pl259 » Fri May 07, 2010 6:13 am

Adding some hydrogen peroxide to the water will help cut down on the mold and increase the growth rate of the sprouts.

Eric

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Postby Dancing frogs » Fri May 07, 2010 11:22 am

pl259 wrote:Adding some hydrogen peroxide to the water will help cut down on the mold and increase the growth rate of the sprouts.

Eric


Already tried that...it works to some extent, but still having problems.
Springtail/aphid co-culture?
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Postby Sports_Doc » Fri May 07, 2010 1:33 pm

Nice trick Eric. I'll have to try that.

I get my cultures from the garden. Rose bushes, plum trees, veggies. They are all around if you look for them. Look at the new tender growth.

Keeping the beans ahead of them is the problem indoors. I can never keep them going for long.......because I'm not disciplined enough to make beans frequently.

Shawn
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Postby Dancing frogs » Fri May 07, 2010 1:39 pm

Sports_Doc wrote:Nice trick Eric. I'll have to try that.

I get my cultures from the garden. Rose bushes, plum trees, veggies. They are all around if you look for them. Look at the new tender growth.

Keeping the beans ahead of them is the problem indoors. I can never keep them going for long.......because I'm not discipline enough to make beans frequently.

Shawn


Yeah...it would be nice if the beans grew faster...I'd try a heat mat, but I hate to even think about adding another heat source to my apt...
Brian T. Sexton

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Postby pl259 » Fri May 07, 2010 3:47 pm

Did any of the dried pea varieties work for you? When I was working with them, I added the peroxide to the initial soaking solution for the peas, as well as the water to dampen the paper towels.

Eric

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Postby Dancing frogs » Sun May 09, 2010 12:59 am

The aphids are now migrating towards the black eyed pea plants...probably because the hosts are about used up.

A search for organic solutions to my molding problem found a few leads.
Cinnamon is an age old anti fungal.
Cornmeal is also supposed to help.
A gentle breeze is said to help too...I knew that, but havent tried it...for some reason, a fan blowing on hundreds of unenclosed insects in my apartment doesn't sound like a good idea :lol: ...I may try it on my brand new, un-innoculated sprouts.

I tried adding a few springtails, but probaly not enough to do the job...I could picture them munching on the sprouts too...once I get the hang of the whole practice, I may try lots of springs in the aphid culture...might work out good...once the plants turn to mush, the springtails should boom.
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Postby Dancing frogs » Sun May 09, 2010 1:11 am

Also just found out that legumes rely on bacteria in the soil, and brand new soil ( soil that has not had legumes grown in it before) lacks this bacteria, therefore, most of the time, a first crop of beans will do poorly, so it sounds like recycling the soil should help...but if it's full of mold, would it still be better?

I never guessed keeping frogs would be the gateway to bean farming...
Brian T. Sexton

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Postby thedude » Mon May 10, 2010 2:30 pm

Dancing frogs wrote:Also just found out that legumes rely on bacteria in the soil, and brand new soil ( soil that has not had legumes grown in it before) lacks this bacteria, therefore, most of the time, a first crop of beans will do poorly, so it sounds like recycling the soil should help...but if it's full of mold, would it still be better?

I never guessed keeping frogs would be the gateway to bean farming...


try using an organic potting soil rich in nitrogen, thats whats most legumes go for.


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