Most productive food for springtails

Culturing Fruit Flies, other Insects. Supplements and Dusting.
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Philsuma
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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Philsuma » Mon Jan 30, 2012 3:53 pm

Springtails CAN be dusted - I've seen it done. But most people cannot culture that amount and also have the patience to do it right - that's why we can't recommend that process for beginners. A lot of people try to cut corners that way and hope for the viv to "feed everyone" on it's own without adding insects and we all know that's not practical yet, if ever.

I don't wanna jack your thread into tadpole nutrition Stu...maybe I'll Necro an appropriate tad thread here in a few.

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Stu&Shaz » Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:10 pm

Philsuma wrote:Springtails CAN be dusted - I've seen it done. But most people cannot culture that amount and also have the patience to do it right - that's why we can't recommend that process for beginners. A lot of people try to cut corners that way and hope for the viv to "feed everyone" on it's own without adding insects and we all know that's not practical yet, if ever.

I don't wanna jack your thread into tadpole nutrition Stu...maybe I'll Neco an appropriate tad thread here in a few.

Bro if we are all learning and debating something that is of importance to our frogs then I'm up for hijacking ,but i'll apologise for taking it off topic,because i can't help but ask questions ,before i forget them :lol: ,i'll also apologise for not being orderly on you ace forum ,but its all with a good heart mate,which you know i guess,oh for an orderly brain, :oops:
Oh and yup i do dust our wild springs,but thats just betwixt us...shhhh :D
Stu

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Stu&Shaz » Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:12 pm

frogfreak wrote:I use nutritional yeast, Stu.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nutritional_yeast

Glen a belated question,why the nutrional yeast not bakers...what is the significance ...is there something deep that I'm missing?
Stu

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby frogfreak » Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:22 pm

Stu&Shaz wrote:
frogfreak wrote:I use nutritional yeast, Stu.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nutritional_yeast

Glen a belated question,why the nutrional yeast not bakers...what is the significance ...is there something deep that I'm missing?
Stu


It has a lot of protein and contains a good amount of folic acid. http://www.bestnaturalfoods.com/nutritional_yeast.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folic_acid
Glenn

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby RichFrye » Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:29 pm

Philsuma wrote:I think that's why the clay use in enclosure design is becoming so important - transfer of calcium to springtails in the viv.

...trying to make a joke @ the little debbies.

Rich, you agree that while springs are essential to start the obligate froglets on, dusted small FF need to be utilized as quickly as possible ?



I do think that FFs are very important early on. One reason being, even if the frogs are too small to take them, FFs walking around early gets the froglets used to FFs. And as soon as they feel they can take them , they are there. But all pums like springs and very , very big frogs can and will take down very , very small bugs. Like my terribilis and mites.
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.

My new email address is rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby RichFrye » Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:40 pm

It has long been my contention that some people are failing to express the major component of the term "supplements". By definition our supplements are there to offer up what is not fed. If fed great varieties of good stuff , you really rely less on supplements (pill popping) and more on nutritional foods (good diet).

Anybody care to guess at the calcium content of a non-flushed viv which has been up and running for ten years? I'm guessing a pretty fair amount of dusted FFs contribute to a high content.
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.

My new email address is rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby frogfreak » Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:53 pm

You left out one part, Rich. What are you feeding your springtails?
Glenn

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby RichFrye » Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:30 pm

I feed mostly baker's yeast. But I also have a number of vivs running only for springtail production. So those are eating all kinds of stuff.
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.


If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.

My new email address is rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby EntoCraig » Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:11 pm

A few weeks back I was having issues with my FF's getting too dry. This resulted in bits of dried media falling into my tanks during feeding...


The springtails piled on top of this stuff! I generally feed fish flak food and let the mold and fungi on the damp leaves provide additional food.


Maybe I should dry up some FF media into small chunks and test the results.

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Stu&Shaz » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:31 pm

EntoCraig wrote:A few weeks back I was having issues with my FF's getting too dry. This resulted in bits of dried media falling into my tanks during feeding...


The springtails piled on top of this stuff! I generally feed fish flak food and let the mold and fungi on the damp leaves provide additional food.


Maybe I should dry up some FF media into small chunks and test the results.


what ff media are you using Craig?,as far as i'm concerned test away, I posted this because of the density of some cultures i have seen,and wanting to get nearer to those,its not that we are struggling just looking for better,so every new input is worthy of a test,here,just a matter of beating what we are doing now.Slightly off the culturing but related really good results are coming from our rearing tubs,a good dose of coarse orchid bark,topped off with part rotted beech and oak leaf litter,all microwaved ,then allowed to get to frog room temp for 24hrs. we then add springs,at first a mould occurs but the springs eat this and seriously increase in number,once the mould subsides in go froglets ,so its difficult to know where the end results would be,but its gets the froglets away it seems
Stu

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby fieldsmith » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:46 pm

I'm having really good luck using ABG and microwaved mushrooms. My cultures look like a cloud when I open them from all the springs jumping. I've divided one starter into about 8 large ziplocs, given away/sold at least 8 smaller cultures, feed out every few days, and still have way more than I need. I don't think feeding solely mushrooms is in any a well-rounded diet, but for production it has been the best. I hear great reports about yeast...never saw good production when I was using it (though I may have been underfeeding). Just may have to test out the FF media idea.
-Field Smith
Some frogs...

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Philsuma » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:48 pm

With the introduction of most any type of FF media ,especially "used" media....comes the introduction of:

Mites.

Not that mites are horrible, frogs eat them, and it's not that hard to beat them and work around them....it's just a PITA.

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby EntoCraig » Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:00 pm

Philsuma wrote:With the introduction of most any type of FF media ,especially "used" media....comes the introduction of:

Mites.

Not that mites are horrible, frogs eat them, and it's not that hard to beat them and work around them....it's just a PITA.


Yeah im not recomending it, just stating an observation.

@ Stu/Shaz, just Josh's media, nothing special. I add more water now...

Im getting tons of springs on the leaf litter and fish food with small spraying once a week. One of my tank grows mushrooms often so Im going to try those in a culture or 2.

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby RanaVenenosa » Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:50 pm

My springtail staples are carrots, mushrooms, or whatever veggie/fruit needs to be tossed from the fridge.
Scott - North Dallas

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Stu&Shaz » Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:24 pm

RichFrye wrote:It has long been my contention that some people are failing to express the major component of the term "supplements". By definition our supplements are there to offer up what is not fed. If fed great varieties of good stuff , you really rely less on supplements (pill popping) and more on nutritional foods (good diet).

Anybody care to guess at the calcium content of a non-flushed viv which has been up and running for ten years? I'm guessing a pretty fair amount of dusted FFs contribute to a high content.

Alot of wisdom in this post methinks Rich,i'm constantly in a state of mad rush of late,and i almost overlooked this,the joy of the written word and being able to go back,i'll chuck an apology up for not noting what was written first time !! The ethos of good grub is close to my heart(for my family) and so it should be for our frogs
thanks
Stu

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Stu&Shaz » Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:33 pm

fieldsmith wrote:I'm having really good luck using ABG and microwaved mushrooms. My cultures look like a cloud when I open them from all the springs jumping. I've divided one starter into about 8 large ziplocs, given away/sold at least 8 smaller cultures, feed out every few days, and still have way more than I need. I don't think feeding solely mushrooms is in any a well-rounded diet, but for production it has been the best. I hear great reports about yeast...never saw good production when I was using it (though I may have been underfeeding). Just may have to test out the FF media idea.

Hey buddy seems along time no speak,thanks for the help,a question how long on the mushrooms in the microwave and wattage of said gizmo please? i appeciate the comment about maybe not enough yeast,i think a very good point to raise,
much thanks mate
Stu

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Stu&Shaz » Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:53 pm

Philsuma wrote:With the introduction of most any type of FF media ,especially "used" media....comes the introduction of:

Mites.

Not that mites are horrible, frogs eat them, and it's not that hard to beat them and work around them....it's just a PITA.

I would not use "used" media for sure Phil,but why would unused be so condusive to mites?
Glen if you read this i just got what PITA means :lol: ...
thanks Phil on both counts
Stu

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Stu&Shaz » Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:59 pm

RanaVenenosa wrote:My springtail staples are carrots, mushrooms, or whatever veggie/fruit needs to be tossed from the fridge.

very similar to what i do Scott,mine predominantly home grown,are you happy with the results you get mate?
thanks
Stu

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby Philsuma » Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:10 pm

Stu,

Any grain-based foodstuff is gonna be a magnet for mites. Baby cereal, potato flakes like those in FF media. That's why some people go to great lengths to just use bakers yeast ect, to keep the mites from enjoying the food.

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Re: Most productive food for springtails

Postby cbreon » Wed Feb 01, 2012 9:00 pm

In lieu of this conversation and my own recent mite problems I have been rethinking my whole springtail strategy. My experience is that you cant beat the production from the powdered baby food and fish flake, but if you use those two foods frequently its difficult to avoid the mites. So, my solution is to keep two separate groups of of springs. One only fed yeast and kept in the separate area on mite paper, these will serve as my master cultures. I will then keep my other spring cultures in another area, also on mite paper, but I will feed them the foods I have found to be more productive but prone to mites. Then I will cycle the cultures, once the flake-fed cultures start to slow down b/c of mites or whatever, I will cycle in new ones from my master cultures and build additional master cultures. For those of you wondering, I currently have about 12 shoebox cultures at various stages in this process.


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