Dendrobates azureus courting and Egg Developement - Pics

Eggs, Tadpoles, Froglets
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Dendrobates azureus courting and Egg Developement - Pics

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:30 am

This morning I found our two Dendrobates azureus sitting side by side in the same bromeliad. The suspected male appeared to be inside the bromeliad (this is one of his usual hang outs) and the suspected female was on a leaf right next to him. I think the male is about 10 months, and the female is about 12 months. Here's a really bad picture (I did not want to disturb them so I snapped a quick picture with my iPod:

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You can't see the male, he is inside the bromeliad and hidden by the crypt leaf. They have been there about an hour, and at this time of day they are usually out on the viv floor waiting for a feeding. I skipped the feeding today so I would not disturb them, but would the consensus be that I may have a pair exhibiting courting / breeding behavior?
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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby Philsuma » Sat Jul 14, 2012 11:49 am

Yep...2 frogs in close proximity like that is a very good indicator.

I would use 1-2 coco huts with plastic or glass petri dish type bottoms for bowers / egg deposition for Tincs and tinc type species. They will use broms, but I've had much better success with cocohuts.

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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 2:31 pm

I think they are laying! They have been in that brom for over 5 hours. They are rotating positions in the brom each spending several minutes in the center while the other moves out to a leaf. I have setup my macro lens on a tripod with a remote trigger so hopefully I can get a few pictures of this process. Hey are in a heavily planted section of the viv so we will see how he pictures turn out.

Exiting! What a newb reaction eh? But this is pretty cool.
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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby Philsuma » Sat Jul 14, 2012 2:44 pm

they probably are ! Very exciting. I remember mine laying for the first time and it was awesome.

Keep in mind, most dart frogs need a requisite amount of space or you may see 'bad' production - lack of properly fertilized eggs ect. That's why, for the larger and more 'terrestrial' species...the larger, flatter cocohut is a better choice of bower.

You can always wait and see...no worries or time limitations. They will most likely keep on breeding, so you have lots of time and options to experiment with. Part of the fun of the hobby....the 'science'.

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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 2:55 pm

I don't want to disturb them but do you think it is worth it to open the viv and drop a petri dish in now? Not sure if the will switch sites but it may be worth a try. I do feel sorry for them trying to rotate around in that tiny brom!
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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby Philsuma » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:06 pm

sure...go ahead and drop in a cocohut with bottom dish. It won't hurt.

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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:21 pm

Ok - I don't have a cocohut handy right now so I grabbed some tree moss, saturated it, and threw it inside a "cave" in the back of the viv that had a mexican pebble base. That evened out the surface, and I put the petri dish in there. It's more secluded then where they are now, and it's only about 4 to 6 inches from the brom they are using. Here's a close up of the dish:
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And a wider angle view of the location to the far left. You can see the two frogs watching me with interest.
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They are still using the brom, so I'm not sure they will make the shift, but this location may be promising in the future.
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:24 pm

Genius! Thanks Phil! They are both inspecting the dish now.
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:41 pm

Heh - they checked out the dish and went back to the brom! Some better pictures from the process. In between rotations through the broms they have been moving around the surrounding area with BigSpot pursuing LittleSpot and rubbing "him" (my guess).
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Here is a sequence of them switching positions within the brom. It's 2:40 PM local time and they have been doing this since 8:00 AM. Let me know if this is old hat for you guys, but it seems like everyone likes pictures! It's fun documenting this. Glad it happened on a Saturday.
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BigSpot is in the brom while LittleSpot is up on a leaf.
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Here they are switching positions in the brom.
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It's a really tight squeeze for them and you can see BigSpot planting her foot squarely on LittleSpot's head as she climbs up out of the brom.
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Here they are switching again.
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BigSpot back in the brom. LittleSpot is back up top.
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Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
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http://www.oneillscrossing.com/dart-frogs/

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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:58 pm

A few more selected photos from today
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.
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby Philsuma » Sat Jul 14, 2012 4:18 pm

GREAT pics ! Yep...they are quite the pair. Look for egg production to kick into high gear. Be sure you have a good/varied/fresh supp and calc rotation....and feed heavy.

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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 4:40 pm

They have been on repcal calcium with vit d, herptivite, and dendrocare rotation. I just picked up fresh supplements and I added repashy calcium plus. I've been feeding them heavily for the last two months since I had the extra flies and they got noticeably fatter. So much so I was a bit concerned about overdressing so I cut back to every other day since they were getting lazy and not hunting the tougher to reach flies. I'll resume daily feedings now. Thanks for all these tips! We are so excited. I just drew out pictures for my 3.5 year old on how an egg/tad/frog develops.

One question. Would you bother trying to pull the eggs from this brow or just let this batch go and hope they lay the next one in the petri dish?
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
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http://www.oneillscrossing.com/dart-frogs/

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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby Rusty_Shackleford » Sat Jul 14, 2012 4:53 pm

If I were in your shoes I would just let them do their thing with this one. It's gonna be a PITA to carefully scrape the eggs from the leaf of the brom, especially while it's still in the viv. But you can put a few little water receptacles in the viv and when the tads do hatch you can watch the male transport the tads to water.
Just a little heads up, don't be surprised if you get only a few fertile eggs. Your male is kinda young for a tinc which may take up to two years to fully mature. As this is their first spawn it may take them a few tries to get it right, but eventually they will.
Jon - Ft. Myers, FL
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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 4:58 pm

Thanks for the tip! Yeah I'm not expecting much from this batch! It's just exciting to see this happening. This was one of the reasons I added frogs to our collection of animals. I want to expose our kids to as many different animals and how they live as I could. The kids absolutely love the frogs and are really watching inquisitively as they develop. Can't wait for the first set of viable eggs so we can track their development!

I'll just leave this batch in there and take care to ensure the brom does not dry out. I'll add the water sources as you suggested as well!
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
lorenzo - schwinn line|NAIB true sips|fantastica nominant
http://www.oneillscrossing.com/dart-frogs/

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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 5:39 pm

I suppose I can change my footer from 0.0.2 to 1.1.0 now no? :mrgreen:
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
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Re: Azureus courting?

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 5:58 pm

5 pm local time and the female is on the floor of the viv and the male is head first in the brom.
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
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http://www.oneillscrossing.com/dart-frogs/

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Re: Azureus courting ? pics

Postby Rusty_Shackleford » Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:12 pm

It would be a neat thing for your kids to see the tads on the males back as he transports them. Always a magical moment.
Also remember for future reference, usually the male deposits sperm befor the female deposits her eggs The old rule of thumb, or old wives tale has been to wait 24-48 hours after laying to remove the eggs. I ususally wait 24 hours but no longer. Generally when you see them away from the laying spot they are done. Now, in most species the male will return to the eggs every couple of days to check on them and keep them moist by watering them.
Jon - Ft. Myers, FL
Help stop the spread of Chytrid! Disinfect your waste water before disposing of it and double bag all solid wastes please!!

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Re: Azureus courting ? pics

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 7:24 pm

6:20 pm local time and both frogs have moved into the petri dish I put out this afternoon. My daughter is complaining "I can't see! It's too dark!" they are under a 6" ledge that extends out from the back wall. It's quite secluded and the best I can do for the without a husk. I'll see how this goes.
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
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http://www.oneillscrossing.com/dart-frogs/

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Re: Azureus courting ? pics

Postby joneill809 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 8:30 pm

Took a few more photos this evening as the frogs were moving around the viv. BigSpot moved down from the brom to the viv floor some time before 5:20 while LittleSpot tended to the brom. Here is BigSpot out front and two shots of LittleSpot, first facing out, then examining the brom. He did this several times.
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BigSpot out hunting.
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LittleSpot inside the brom.
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LittleSpot checking on the brom.
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About an hour later they were both in the petri dish. I did not get a photo of this - it's dark and needs to be lit, and I did not want to disturb them. Soon after that BigSpot once again left LittleSpot to tend to the dish and began hunting on the viv floor. I did get photos of the two of them at this point.
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Another image if BigSpot out hunting.
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breeding-1918-littleSpotDish_0835.JPG
I briefly lit the dish with a flashlight to get this shot. It's very dark in the back of the viv where the dish is nestled.
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About 10 minutes later LittleSpot joined BigSpot on the viv floor hunting. I dropped a good amount of flies in and they both ate heartily. Lights out at 7:30, so no more photos tonight. I'll give them another big meal in the morning - they absolutely destroyed about 100 flies tonight. Long day. I'll keep posting as this progresses. This has been an interesting process and hopefully some of the posts and photos will help other Newbs going through similar experiences!
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
lorenzo - schwinn line|NAIB true sips|fantastica nominant
http://www.oneillscrossing.com/dart-frogs/

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Re: Azureus courting ? pics

Postby joneill809 » Sun Jul 15, 2012 10:41 am

No eggs in the petri dish, but there were some in the brom! So would you guys advise a newb to attempt to remove these eggs, or leave them in place? I have some straws in the house that I can fashion into a scoop, I just don't know if I'll end up doing more damage that good - these eggs are small!
breeding-firstEggs_0883.JPG
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Any pointers on what fertile azureus eggs should look like?
Jim from Austin please contact me if you are willing to trade offspring from:
lorenzo - schwinn line|NAIB true sips|fantastica nominant
http://www.oneillscrossing.com/dart-frogs/


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