The title pretty much says it all. This frog is rates a close second to Phoebe Cates pool scene as to what I would want to watch at any particular moment.
So that being said. I have been reading about dart care for years. However my experience is limited to just six months. Because my reefing back ground, I am use to obsessing over parameters. The price of the frogs doesn't bother me. My issue is that there is a very limited supply of these frogs and it would be extremely careless of me to jump the gun on these frogs and potentially ruin the future availability of this frog.
SOOOO
What qualifies one to possess these fantastic frogs, besides the cash?
I would like to hear opinions on when everybody thinks a frogger can jump to this level?
Would it be 5 years in the hobby?
The ability to successfully breed other obligates?
DO I just need to stay in a holiday inn one night?
Let me know your thoughts.
-B
EXCELLENT thread 'B'...seriously.
Legal Histo's are in the hobby - yes they are. Red heads. And cash is still king, especially in these tough times.
But....
The majority of rare obligate breeders tend to distribute to like-mined and highly experienced fellow hobbyists. That would put you far down the line - or at least it should.
" My issue is that there is a very limited supply of these frogs and it would be extremely careless of me to jump the gun on these frogs and potentially ruin the future availability of this frog" .
VERY mature and proper mindset here.I applaud you.
Phoebe Cates.... havent heard that name in a long time. : ) lot a old foggies in this hobby LOL
IMHO I don't think there is a magic number of years. I would certainly cut my teeth on Pumilio for a while... If you can successfully morph quality froglets with consistency, you will have learned many hard lesson along the way that will serve you well for future frog endeavors.
-Scott
Phoebe Cates...Fast times at Ridgemont hight...Spricoli...Mr. Hand...
Ranks right up there with Gone with da Wind IMHO.
![[Image: Phoebe_Cates_Fast_Times_at_Ridgemont_High_HDTV_19.jpg]](http://jsrpages.co.uk/scans/cates2/Phoebe_Cates_Fast_Times_at_Ridgemont_High_HDTV_19.jpg)
I hope you're cool with this little sidetrack B....memories...ahh. 8)
She's also 48 - much older than me or Stu or Rich !! and married to 65 yr old craddle robber Kevin Kline.
We can totally change the thread to be entirely about Phoebe Cates.
I even think there should be a rule in place that this kind of sidetrack is not only acceptable but encouraged.
And I completely agree with this being number one.
http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/80s/conte ... me-mr-skin
By the way if any one want's to talk about histos feel free to jump in and squash this awesome flashback every one is having.
-B
Full Disclosure: This is all unfounded opinion, I have never kept any obligates. First thought when I read the title of this post "Me too", second thought "Good luck"
. I think you have gotten some good advice...start with more common obligates, get experience with their captive needs, then think about working your way up. So many of us feel the same way...I would love to get some histos one day. Honestly, that's why I'm glad they are hard to get and usually end up in experienced hands...that way there's a better chance that when I'm ready they will still be in the hobby. I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for responsible imports (aren't we all?).
P.S. I was just talking about that scene from FT at RH earlier tonight, one of the best in the history of film
Are they really legal or did the parent stock originate from dubious places?
Philsuma Wrote:Legal Histo's are in the hobby - yes they are. Red heads. And cash is still king, especially in these tough times.
The buyer needs to do his or her own research / due dilligence.
Histrionicus were legally imported into the U.S in the 1990's. Could founding stock have survived to produce froglets @ 12-15 years later. I personally think it's possible.
Possible, but yet no one can point to these breedings. I've seen groups of 20-40 histros coming into the states every year from Europe. That is more likely and well....their founding stock is questionable.
Philsuma Wrote:The buyer needs to do his or her own research / due dilligence.
Histrionicus were legally imported into the U.S in the 1990's. Could founding stock have survived to produce froglets @ 12-15 years later. I personally think it's possible.
Possible with the case of available "red heads" that the majority of frogs out in the hobby came from one original breeding pair. Mind you a very successful breeding pair. Something to think about, rather than jumping the gun and assuming questionable origins...............
Funny, I had not even considered the legality of the frogs. I had just assumed they were legal.
does anybody know exactly how common they are?
I only know of one breeder. I am hoping there are many more that just don't post on the boards.
-B
I'm curious, but how would this change their legalility if the orginal pair was acquired illegally? I personally think the herp hobby, in particular dart frogs, has been too accepting of animals from illegal parent stock.
evolvstll Wrote:Possible with the case of available "red heads" that the majority of frogs out in the hobby came from one original breeding pair. Mind you a very successful breeding pair. Something to think about, rather than jumping the gun and assuming questionable origins...............
Ok, I'll bite.. I have a group of red heads and their care is very similar to how I keep my other obligates. My frogs are still a little young to breed so I can't speak on that regard, however the person I acquired mine from has had really good success with the frogs he is keeping (please do not ask me who).
I do think there is a very real possibility that the frogs purchased legally back in the 90's are still around and producing a lot of what is present in the hobby today (or at least stock that originated from these frogs). Im also inclined to think that a good amount of what's "available" are not here through legal avenues simply based on the high demand for these frogs.. I guess for me what it came down to was the seller had a reasonable response to every question/concern I could come up with and his status in the hobby spoke for itself. I visited his home and observed his frogs breeding and based my decision to purchase them off of these factors. As far as their availability goes, I think it comes down to "earning your stripes" in the hobby. Attend meets, work with some of the more common frogs, and be active in the community. I never actively pursued acquiring histos and was contacted after having spent a reasonable amount of time in the hobby and having pretty good "success" with the animals I had kept.
Chris
Fantastic answer. (Where the heck do I click to thank Chris for that awesome answer?)
Chris what frogs did you have before you acquired the histos?
and how bold are the Histos? ?
Armson Wrote:Fantastic answer. (Where the heck do I click to thank Chris for that awesome answer?)
On each post is a menu along the top middle. Click on the thumbs up symbol next to "quote".
BluePumilio Wrote:I'm curious, but how would this change their legalility if the orginal pair was acquired illegally? I personally think the herp hobby, in particular dart frogs, has been too accepting of animals from illegal parent stock.
evolvstll Wrote:Possible with the case of available "red heads" that the majority of frogs out in the hobby came from one original breeding pair. Mind you a very successful breeding pair. Something to think about, rather than jumping the gun and assuming questionable origins...............
The mentioned pair of frogs is from an old time frogger and were from original imports and very legal and are still breeding.