Dart Den

I saw on kingsnake that there are new Tinc locales. Can anyone shed insight on this? How many new locales are there, just the two?

i saw that too. love some info on that. but really leaning towards someone just throwing a new title at them. but love to see new locals

There's gotta be lots of 'new' or undiscovered locales.

Bigger question is who is the main importer and can we trust the location ?

I agree on that 100 %

I agree. They didn't look that much different from others already here and the two new morphs looked very similar. I know that you can go by looks/ patterns though. Just wish we had more info on them. You would think you would've heard about new locales before they came in on an import.

Nothing too exciting.

frogfreak Wrote:Nothing too exciting.

Agree...plus the Hobby is currently in another 'low' in terms of activity and $$. Frogs are not too exciting right now which is very typical for a luxury animal hobby. Gotta wait a few quarters or months and hope for 'buzz' and buying again.

Philsuma Wrote:

frogfreak Wrote:Nothing too exciting.

Agree...plus the Hobby is currently in another 'low' in terms of activity and $$. Frogs are not too exciting right now which is very typical for a luxury animal hobby. Gotta wait a few quarters or months and hope for 'buzz' and buying again.

I'd be more excited if it was the "Peacock Tinc" or perhaps a red Tinc. That would kick azz!!

Of course, then there's the question of legality and/or where they came from... :|

These are coming out of Surinam legally, the same people that are bringing out the Atelopus, I have heard they may be 1 morph they have broken into 2 based on pattern but that is here say. These guys have been exporting for a while so I assume their CITES documents are legit.

Just like EU / German CITES paperwork...I'm sure it would pass legalities. Do Tincs still get poached in Brazil and boated up river to be sold as Surinam or French Guyana Frogs ? Probably.

Again, the real question is to trust the locale / GPS info.

Yes but Phil no dart frogs occur in Europe or Germany...jk, I assume after the Galac fiasco that Brazil monitors a little more closely but there would still be lag time before they got to them. Considering these morphs resemble known morphs from Surinam one would assume they are taking animals from the country they are exporting from....gotta think of the expense of transporting frogs a long distance and then selling them for $40 - $65 each, which I am sure these are selling for at the export level.

Brazil can barely control it's own country. I just watched a documentary on their favelos directly around Rio. Police and military are afraid to go in there. It would be like - if you dialed 911 in Harlem and they just told you over the phone 'sorry, no one's coming out to help you'.

The smuggled animals coming up the Amazon/interstate must be huge and varied in species and number. I'd imagine you can still get almost any critter you want in south America boated upstream. The boat traffic on that river must be staggering, so policing it....I dunno. I doubt they put much of dent in it, unless someone here can tell us otherwise.

I would only say that logically the exporter would likely pay their employees to catch animals locally rather than buy them from someone else. If it were a matter of locals collecting stuff and dropping it off or their own employees or local "guides", those would be far cheaper than getting animals through several hundred miles of river traffic, which I am not even sure how one would navigate from Brazil to the northern coast of Surinam. Now if like in the 90's there was this huge demand for Galacs and they were being brought out by the hundreds into Europe and I am sure some steep prices were paid, that type of scenario makes sense...but common Tincs? I would assume Brazilian Yellowheads & Lorenzo's would be high on the demand list and if people are paying a little more...boom they show up. I don't really see any red flags with this type of import, as someone said previous nothing to get too excited about, but when there is that's when I start wondering how or why it is happening.
And as for Brazil I don't think it is them so much policing as it is people knowing what comes from Brazil and those in the know ratting people out. That's what happened when the Galacs out of Surinam got shut down years ago, someone in Europe alerted the authorities and the smuggler was arrested and amazingly lives today on the lam in Brazil of all places. I know the snake people too monitor if the Brazil stuff comes out, someone gets called

oh no, don't get me wrong...I think this particular import is fine. I see no reason to bring out the microscope with no red flags that i've heard of. We are just talking about frogs and imports in general here...getting off on a little tangent.

It sometimes seems like every import that comes in get's the 'stink eye' but in some regards that may actually be a good thing. Otherwise no one would ever give the slightest care and we would be in a world of shit with that overall attitude. Meh - discussion comes with the hobby. The good people have Nothing to ever worry about, as I see it.

Philsuma Wrote:

frogfreak Wrote:Nothing too exciting.

Agree...plus the Hobby is currently in another 'low' in terms of activity and $$. Frogs are not too exciting right now which is very typical for a luxury animal hobby. Gotta wait a few quarters or months and hope for 'buzz' and buying again.

I don't get the luxury hobby thing. Most all frogs and tanks can be bought for less than my bulldog and fed for less.

I also don't get all the venom and hate.....

where do you and Justyn see 'Venom and Hate" ? Please cite examples.

A single 10 gallon tank and frog may not be expensive but a frog room or medium sized collection definitely is and very time consuming to boot.

Phil venom...poison arrow frogs...poison/venom

As for cost I just set up 4 new V-Scape vivs, 2 15" x 17" x 24" and 2 18" x 20" x 36"...the vivs cost me a little over $500, the materials to set them up about $400...and now frogs to go in them. I will say after the initial set up there is not a lot of expense in maintaining but $1000 for 4 tanks less the frog expense is not a cheap hobby unless you compare it to Marine Reef, that can truly be a money pit.

Not enough time to cite, just general feel for the forums of the hobby, not this thread.

Philsuma Wrote:where do you and Justyn see 'Venom and Hate" ? Please cite examples.

A single 10 gallon tank and frog may not be expensive but a frog room or medium sized collection definitely is and very time consuming to boot.

Phil I think this comes from a glass half empty mentality, it's great to question things, especially when we all see red flags but the tone of this forum has mostly been guilty until proven innocent. OK for some and sometimes a good thing if it prevents one jackass from stealing from someone trying to buy a few Vanzo's but most people have a hobby to enjoy it, that can be hard to do sometimes when participating in a forum where different levels of expectations occur.