Supplements - What kind ? Rotation ?

[Rusty_Shackleford]

Thanks Phil, I'm glad you knew what I meant even if I didn't. Sometimes the neurons aren't firing until the coffee hits the system.

I think it's kind of a natural progression in the hobby to begin to explore a rotation of supplements as well as additional food sources, housing techniques, etc. as you advance and gain knowledge about your frogs.

[Philsuma]

hmmm...I dust almost every single feeding with some supplement, be it calc or Vit or colour enhancer.

My pumilio groups have a very low SLS rate.

[ChrisK]

Yeah I dust EVERY feeding, but I only feed once or twice weekly depending on the tank, breeding/egg feeding etc (really for years now).

[Stu&Shaz]

I'm one of those using just repashy guys,ha I'm also a newbe :roll: :lol:
We dust all feeds of ff with Ca+,we dust one feed every 2 weeks with the repashy vit A supplement. Honestly I'm beyond thrilled with our results so far,i see your point of view guys,i think these vits a very important,i see why you want to rotate,your trying to make up for deficiencies in one product. My take is slightly different i suppose in that,i focus on the diet and see the suplements as the word implies as secondary to that diet.So i try and get hold of wild grub to add to the species we culture,i will add that there is a risk to this wild grub.Its a stickied thread for a new guy,he should know there are risks and also that we are in England (uk). I feed live wild grub to tadpoles, plus cylcoops eeze 2 types of fish flake and NLS amphibian formula.the growing frogs/adults get aphid small spiders springtails baby iso amongst other wild caught goodies, plus the cultured various ff 3types of iso bean weavils 3 types of springtail.We also add Ca(grated culttlefish bone..eggshells) to our springs and iso cultures,for them to munch on. We also vary the diet of most feeders
We utilise the best uvb lights we can get our hands on from Arcadia

This post is in no way meant to undermine your thoughts and wisdom,guys,its more than i have to offer!! What I'm trying to get over i guess is that i wish we spent more time worrying about how we could improve the actual diet of our frogs,maybe a slightly different mindset. I think in time this is one area that we can and should move forward on

Phil i hope this stays within topic,their food is just so important,
best always

Stu

[Philsuma]

Stu,

I find the average hobbyist to cut corners most times - hence trying to get by with only one single powered sup - calc and vit combined or even no supplementation !

Harvesting meadow plankton, varied diets are not the norm, mores the pity. Also, I don't trust viv populations of crunchy insects to provide necessary calcium levels, turface or spilled supps be damned.

I'll still swear by a varied supplement rotation.

[Rusty_Shackleford]

Stu what kind of Eurpoean supplements are available over there besides Nekton and Dendrocare? Those are the only two I've ever heard of so I'm kinda curious.

[Stu&Shaz]

Stu,

I find the average hobbyist to cut corners most times - hence trying to get by with only one single powered sup - calc and vit combined or even no supplementation !

Harvesting meadow plankton, varied diets are not the norm, mores the pity. Also, I don't trust viv populations of crunchy insects to provide necessary calcium levels, turface or spilled supps be damned.

I'll still swear by a varied supplement rotation.

Bro ya good?
Yes i hear you Phil,i understand exactly where your coming from!your commitment towards the novice is beyond commendable,my post was really just trying to make those new guys that are willing think a bit further. Its important they realise i'm of little time with frogs and don't have a fixed viewpoint yet,we are learning too much too fast. I do try to help out abit too.Maybe its a bit left field but worth putting out there for those whom will look .

Hmm when are you going to teach us how to cut these corners then mate :lol:
best
Stu

[Stu&Shaz]

Stu what kind of Eurpoean supplements are available over there besides Nekton and Dendrocare? Those are the only two I've ever heard of so I'm kinda curious.

Hi Jon,ha i hope your well too my friend.Jon I'll do some digging for you bro,.I'm very short of time,i just wanted to say Hi and bare with me. the obvious one the longer tern keepers have used(if one can find them) is nutribal, although many have reported better results with repashy:more detail will follow
best

Stu

[phelsumaman]

Hi Rusty,
The de facto multivitamin in the uk is nutrobal, I do use this in my rotation however I personally don't think it's up to much, the particle size varies wildly so I really can't be sure that my animals are getting everything that's in there. Also worth mentioning that nutrobal is designed for reptiles rather than darts specifically. I've been using this for as long as I've kept herps (celebrating my quarter century of reptile keeping this November) and I don't think the composition has changed in all of that time.

I also use nekton rep and Dendrocare as part of my multivitamin rotation.

For single vitamins I buy powdered capsules which come from a us company called life extensions, they put a date of production as well as an expiry date on the bottle so I can get a good idea of how long it's been sat in a warehouse! I have found that all of their powdered capsules are micro fine and easy to dust with, I will use d3, calcium and I also use vit a (as retinol) once a month.

Ben

Stu what kind of Eurpoean supplements are available over there besides Nekton and Dendrocare? Those are the only two I've ever heard of so I'm kinda curious.

Ben

[Rusty_Shackleford]

Stu and Ben I appreciate the responses. The reason I asked is just to see what was out on the market over there. I know that Nekton-Rep has long been used over there as a general herp supplement. I was pondering the advance of supplements and was wondering if you were ahead of us over there on that side of the pond.

[Stu&Shaz]

Stu and Ben I appreciate the responses. The reason I asked is just to see what was out on the market over there. I know that Nekton-Rep has long been used over there as a general herp supplement. I was pondering the advance of supplements and was wondering if you were ahead of us over there on that side of the pond.

Ben,thanks for the help buddy,newbe's huh :roll: :lol:

Jon alot of the dart guys here rate repashy very highly, Ben has forgotten more about vits than i'll probably ever be able to assimilate !!!I've been digging abit in europe for alternatives for you,as the hobby in Germany and Holland i believe to be more advanced to ours in blighty. Here are some links for you to ponder on:

http://www.dutch-rana.nl/v2/index.php?p ... &Itemid=79

(oh offtopic have a look in here for some inspiring vivs,the dutch just seem to have a way with plants!!! http://www.dutch-rana.nl/v2/index.php?o ... 06&lang=en )


http://www.terrarientechnik.de/Food/Vit ... 90_72.html

this is what's available here through our only specialist amphibian shop in the UK

http://www.dartfrog.co.uk/equipment/fertiliser.html

I hope this is of some help Jon enjoy the rana site mate,worth also looking at the image gallery again offtopic but again i'm sure it will be of great interest to all,(you'll like the tinc page :wink: )
best

Stu
Stu

[Philsuma]

I would NOT just use one supplement. There are a lot of new people trying to use just 'Rapashy' and nothing else.

I always recommend a rotation of several different supps. I'm almost sure it's a laziness thing. People only want the one quick thing to use and nothing more.

[frogfreak]

I'm almost sure it's a laziness thing.

Phil,

I only use Repashy. I experimented for a long while with Repashy as a stand alone supplement. I was confident in the work Allen did to perfect it and believe that he'll continue to do so. I went out on a limb and decided to try it alone. I've been using it for well over a year and I can see a change in the frogs. They look healthier, are more active and give me good clutches. What more could I ask for? I was going through 5 supps that I wasn't all that confident in. That's why I was using 5 in the first place. Basically, just in case 1 or more were crap. IMO we've be given a supplement that was designed for darts. Times change and we move forward. The days of tossing supps that are 3/4's full are done with me. At this point in time, I see no need to add to my rotation. Not lazy at all! I did my homework/experimentation with this supp AND went out on a limb to chance using a single supplement. I'm very pleased with it.

Best,

[Philsuma]

No worries Glenn.....sometimes my posts get a little preachy and opinionated., but I still feel that a 'Hobby' forum, is fueled by opinion. I totally respect yours, in regards to Rapashy. We can always disagree. On the 'Lazy' remark. Don't take that one personal ! It's kinda like 'if the shoe fits' / look in the mirror, type of statement. You are obviously not lazy in your animal husbandry.

[BcsTx]

Glenn I only use repashy as well, have been for a year or two now and have been having great production 0 spindly leg.
I also have a lot of micro fauna in my vivs, and add springs, several types of isos as well. My pums get fresh springs 3 times a week.

[dtfleming]

Right now I use repashy and nekton rep. I stopped using Rep-cal and herpvite only use that to dust FF for new cultures. Frogs are doing well and have great color. So far all my zarayunga and leucomelas offspring are doing well.

[outofreach]

I would NOT just use one supplement. There are a lot of new people trying to use just 'Rapashy' and nothing else.

I always recommend a rotation of several different supps. I'm almost sure it's a laziness thing. People only one the one, quick thing to use and nothing more.

Right now I just use rapashy calcium plus.

I use only rapashy because I feel I need to have a better understanding before I start mixing stuff. It seems that so much is a matter of opinion and there are so many conflicting opinions it get confusing. I have reptivite and reptical and a couple others but am not using them as of yet. When I got my first frogs a few months ago I ran to the pet store on the way home and they sent me off with rapashy vitamin A. Luckily I did a little research before any problems but I think that vitamin A as a sole supplement everyday wouldn't of ended well.

[outofreach]

Right now I just use rapashy calcium plus.

I use only rapashy because I feel I need to have a better understanding before I start mixing stuff. It seems that so much is a matter of opinion and there are so many conflicting opinions it get confusing. I have reptivite and reptical and a couple others but am not using them as of yet. When I got my first frogs a few months ago I ran to the pet store on the way home and they sent me off with rapashy vitamin A. Luckily I did a little research before any problems but I think that vitamin A as a sole supplement everyday wouldn't of ended well.

Disclaimer..... :mrgreen:

I know I should of done my research before I was on the was home with my frogs now

But I thought, hey come on its just a frog how tough can it be..........

[Rusty_Shackleford]

Right now I just use rapashy calcium plus.

I use only rapashy because I feel I need to have a better understanding before I start mixing stuff. It seems that so much is a matter of opinion and there are so many conflicting opinions it get confusing. I have reptivite and reptical and a couple others but am not using them as of yet. When I got my first frogs a few months ago I ran to the pet store on the way home and they sent me off with rapashy vitamin A. Luckily I did a little research before any problems but I think that vitamin A as a sole supplement everyday wouldn't of ended well.

Disclaimer..... :mrgreen:

I know I should of done my research before I was on the was home with my frogs now

But I thought, hey come on its just a frog how tough can it be..........

Perhaps the first three questions one should ask themselves when considering keeping dart frogs is, Am I responsible enough, am I mature enough, am I intelligent enough to keep dart frogs correctly.
Oh and add in, am I willing to do enough research so that I can practice exemplary husbandry techniques. If the answer is no....well, perhaps a pet rock would be a better choice for you.

[Philsuma]

If I had a $3,000.00 frog collection....or even less, I would budget @ $100.00 per year / EVERY year, for multiple fresh vitamins and Calcium supplements. There is no way in hell, I would be only be using only one brand.