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HELP, frogs are dying !
#1

I am new to this hobby (3 months) and after spending much time researching, finally purchased my frogs on the 1st of March. I got 5 D. Leucs, 4 D. Tincs (Patricias) and 3 D. Azures. The Leucs are two months as frogs and the others are one month as frogs. I kept them in the same shoe box with wet paper towel and a branch of Pathos, feed them daily and clean the box regularly. After one week I put the Leucs in their own vivarium and they are doing great.
The others have been in the same shoe box now for three weeks so they are close to 2 months as frogs. I feed them daily (ff) and clean the box regularly. In the last week I have lost two of the Patricias. The first was the smallest frog and the one today was the largest frog.
Am I feeding them too much? Too many flies stressing the frogs? Or could I have a parasite this early in the game?

Any help would be appreciated. I am afraid to put them into their vivariums as I had planned to do this weekend if they have a parasite.

Steve
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#2

How big is the shoebox? I would say that there are too many frogs/species in the same enclosure and they most likely are stressing each other out or keeping each other from eating. I would seperate them into seperate enclosures and get fecals done on them to be on the safe side.

Luke
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#3

Steve,
am I understanding this correctly, the tincs and azurues you purchased were only a couple of weeks old when you got them?

Anytime you aquire new frogs, you need to quarantine each species/morph individually.
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#4

Thanks Luke, I did that first thing this morning when I found the dead one.
I am putting them in seperate boxes, lesson learned :oops:

Cindy,
I am not positive how old they were when I got them but I was assured that they were old enough to be purchased. At least 2 months as a froglet Tincs and Azures), and Leucs 3 months as froglet. I know I said different earlier but I just checked my calendar and talked to the breeder and got closer dates.

One suggestion has been the supplements that I have been giving them. I have been using Herpcare Cricket Dust which is a pre-mix of both calcium and vitamins. I have been advised that this is not good. Mixing counteracts the vitamins. So I will be switching to Rep-Cal and doing the mixing myself, or should I not mix them, calcium one day and vitamins the next day?

Thanks guys,
Steve
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#5


Steve,
Rep-Cal (calcium suppliment) and Herptivite (multivitamin) are good supplements to use. You can use them together, and for young froglets should be dusted at every feeding and they should be feed everyday.
Both the Rep-Cal and Herptivite have expiration dates stamped on the containers, be sure you are using fresh product.
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#6

Thank you Cindy,
I went out and got some and am now using Rep-cal versus the herpcare, seperated the morphs and have added another chapter into the "stupid things we do" book on frogs. It just bothers me to no end that an innocent animal has to suffer because of stupidity!!

Thanks
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#7

Everyone already hates me on this board so, wtf. Refer to this link:
http://www.dartden.com/viewtopic.php?t=976
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#8

yes, I read that post when it first came out. And I did think, boy that was dumb, we all know better.
In my case, I do believe my froglets are much younger than hers. I was under the mistaken idea that it was ok to keep them together in a small show box when they were that young until your vivarium was completely ready. My mistake.
But let me ask you this v_travis, when is a froglet no longer a froglet?
When do you know they are old enough to go into a vivarium. This is something no one talks about.

Steve
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#9

im sorry to hear about your loss Sad
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#10

sorry to hear of your loss as well good luck with the remaining
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#11

PLEASE READ ALL

I just lost a red amy,... Very sad. I know it wasn't my fault, as all my other tanks and even it's mate are doing great, just bad luck, which happens. Frogs sometimes just die from problems that aren't your fault and you can't see, just like people. This is obviously not what happened in your case, but in the future, beware, occasionally, not very often, one will just die.


To your issue:

As people said, keep the morphs separate. Also beware where you order from. There are some dirty big name froggers out there, and the frogs they sell ALWAYS are infected with something. It's a wise idea to keep your morphs separate, and even ones of the same morph separate if they came from separate places, and get fecal tests.

Here's the fun part: When your frogs show up, and you send your fecals off, and you get notice back that they have, let's just say, hook worms, you get the fun privilege of medicating them every day, and after you medicate them moving them to a freshly washed (I use water mixed with bleach & vinegar.) container/tank. Then the very next day, after they've eaten their meds again, you move them to a clean tank again. After a long time of this you send your fecals off, and you get back, 'They have hook worms,' and you do it all again,...

Maybe not that horrible, but it happens. I know of people who have put hundreds of hours on making sure their new frogs are clean, after the washing the tanks, the moving, and the fecal sending & testing, which costs a little money after a few repeats.

It's all worth it though. It's best to find someone who is breeding their own, and bought the parent frogs their working with long before, and already did the fecal test shuffle. That's your best chance at getting a clean frog if your not up for the fecal challenge. I'm sure there are several people here who could sell you some. I, myself, am waiting on eggs right now, and will hopefully have some babies in the next little while, all from clean parents. And I know there are plenty of others that do their own breeding as well.

Ok, I can't think of anymore to say. Hope that was helpful.

One more note, watch out for the big frogger sites with tons of breeds to pick from. There are a few out there whose owners want the money more than having customers have happy frogs and people who have bought from some of these sites always get frogs with multiple parasites. Just FYI.

Good luck, sorry for your loss. I'd be literally in tears if I lost so many.

EDIT: Also, get them the hell out of the shoe box. That thing is way too small, especially for active tincs, and go get yourself a large sterlite storage container, or three, and some sphagnum + little plastic dixie cups. Boil the sphagnum moss, and layer it on the bottom of the sterlite storage containers(I'd recommend getting the milky, half-assed transparent kind, or the all out transparent kind. I think they are like 45 gallon ones), and cut those dixie cups in half(I use the large sized red & blue kind), giving your frogs the little caves they like. You can put a whole cup or two in there too. Then take a cutting of a plant, a philodendron or wandering jew will be fine, and put it in there, so there's some plant life. Now DON'T CLEAN IT!! They like that kind of environment. Your frogs are now happy in a temporary home till you get things situated.

I would further recommend you do the fecal stuff I mentioned above too. Buy a few ten gallon containers($10 bucks per and the nice glass & plastic lids are another $10), and these will be what you cycle them through while on their medication. Make the inside of them the same as the sterlite containers I mentioned above, and if your frogs are being treated for parasites after you get your fecal results, you need to throw everything in this temporary 10 gallon away & wash it, and put new sphagnum + cups in it every time you cycle the frogs into that container.
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#12

Sorry to hear that..
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#13

Temporary containers are important .Don't just use any small sterlite or plastic box. Too small is hazardous to the frog as well, IMO.

I would use sweaterbox size plastic containers or even slightly bigger.

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