08-31-2005, 04:02 PM
This is a subject that has come up but is apparently not well understood.
I have posted (advertising) that I have "the most diverse colors/patterns " from my intermedius. Not sure if it because I feed a bit differently, because my frogroom and entire house is 100% climate controlled and never reaches temps higher than 75 or lower than 65, because I prophylactically treat my whole collection for nematodes, because I have held back more breeders than the "normal" frog breeder, because I employ an ozone generator, or am I just blessed. What I do know is that there are only a small certain number of true bloodlines in the U.S. , Europe, or any other Dart collecting area of the world , excepting South and Central America. There are in fact "bloodlines" of Standard lamasi in the U.S. that may very well (I am fairly sure) be from the same German supplier and breeding group, therefore making them the same bloodline.
Bloodlines are site specific lines which can be absolutely traced back to site of collection. Bloodlines are not "Rich Frye" intermedius or terribilis, they are not "Patrick" imitators or "Black Jungle" leucs. MANY froggers would be very surprised to know the limited extent of true bloodlines in the States.
To over simplify separate "morphs". They should be treated as separate species. At least until more genetic info can be digested. A Basti separate from a BriBri, from a Darklands, ect. There are/can be different lines of the same morph, but not different morphs from the same line.
There are a few ways to have offspring or an offspring which looks different that others from its line:
1. Color enhancing foods/additives are one way, although I see very little "bang for the buck" as all of the Darts I have worked with seem to be PLENTY colorful as they are.
2. Random chance/genetics. No need for a long winded explanation. Key word "random".
3. Husbandry involving temps, foods not meant for color enhancing , water changes ect. Much of this is still in speculative stages and there are WAY more questions unanswered than answered.
4. THE biggie. Selective breeding. In my opinion, if you are holding back the bluest imitators, the most orange giant oranges, the finest spotted intermedius , or whatever , you are doing a disservice to the hobby. The next step is designer Darts and we don't need that, period. The bluest, most banded, finest spotted , whatever are not going to gravitate to each other in the wild so there is no benefit to selectively forcing them to produce anything at any extreme end of the scale.
If you see pictures of a group of adult albino Darts being kept together, they are being selectively breed, or selectively fought as same sexes would tend to fight, sooner or later. There are few and far between groups of albino darts living together in the wild.
I can see nothing wrong with throwing an albino in with a "normal" group of Darts , just as I can see no problem with throwing an imitator that just happens to have an extraordinary amount of blue on its legs (especially within the same line) in with a group with a "normal" amount of blue. This would happen in nature.
I have a large number of breeding intermedius. They are ALL from the same line. They produce a wide variety of colors and patterns. I do not selectively breed. My intermedius seem to throw quite a varied selection of offspring. Diversity is on the opposite end of selectivity. Nothing more involved than that.
Anyone claiming to have the reddest, bluest, fattest, longest, shortest, loudest ,whatever, either has imported or smuggled in his/her/their own line, or is selectively breeding.
Rich
I have posted (advertising) that I have "the most diverse colors/patterns " from my intermedius. Not sure if it because I feed a bit differently, because my frogroom and entire house is 100% climate controlled and never reaches temps higher than 75 or lower than 65, because I prophylactically treat my whole collection for nematodes, because I have held back more breeders than the "normal" frog breeder, because I employ an ozone generator, or am I just blessed. What I do know is that there are only a small certain number of true bloodlines in the U.S. , Europe, or any other Dart collecting area of the world , excepting South and Central America. There are in fact "bloodlines" of Standard lamasi in the U.S. that may very well (I am fairly sure) be from the same German supplier and breeding group, therefore making them the same bloodline.
Bloodlines are site specific lines which can be absolutely traced back to site of collection. Bloodlines are not "Rich Frye" intermedius or terribilis, they are not "Patrick" imitators or "Black Jungle" leucs. MANY froggers would be very surprised to know the limited extent of true bloodlines in the States.
To over simplify separate "morphs". They should be treated as separate species. At least until more genetic info can be digested. A Basti separate from a BriBri, from a Darklands, ect. There are/can be different lines of the same morph, but not different morphs from the same line.
There are a few ways to have offspring or an offspring which looks different that others from its line:
1. Color enhancing foods/additives are one way, although I see very little "bang for the buck" as all of the Darts I have worked with seem to be PLENTY colorful as they are.
2. Random chance/genetics. No need for a long winded explanation. Key word "random".
3. Husbandry involving temps, foods not meant for color enhancing , water changes ect. Much of this is still in speculative stages and there are WAY more questions unanswered than answered.
4. THE biggie. Selective breeding. In my opinion, if you are holding back the bluest imitators, the most orange giant oranges, the finest spotted intermedius , or whatever , you are doing a disservice to the hobby. The next step is designer Darts and we don't need that, period. The bluest, most banded, finest spotted , whatever are not going to gravitate to each other in the wild so there is no benefit to selectively forcing them to produce anything at any extreme end of the scale.
If you see pictures of a group of adult albino Darts being kept together, they are being selectively breed, or selectively fought as same sexes would tend to fight, sooner or later. There are few and far between groups of albino darts living together in the wild.
I can see nothing wrong with throwing an albino in with a "normal" group of Darts , just as I can see no problem with throwing an imitator that just happens to have an extraordinary amount of blue on its legs (especially within the same line) in with a group with a "normal" amount of blue. This would happen in nature.
I have a large number of breeding intermedius. They are ALL from the same line. They produce a wide variety of colors and patterns. I do not selectively breed. My intermedius seem to throw quite a varied selection of offspring. Diversity is on the opposite end of selectivity. Nothing more involved than that.
Anyone claiming to have the reddest, bluest, fattest, longest, shortest, loudest ,whatever, either has imported or smuggled in his/her/their own line, or is selectively breeding.
Rich
Darts with parasites are analogous to mixed tanks, there are no known benefits to the frogs with either.
If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.
My new email address is: rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476
If tone is more important to you than content, you are at the wrong place.
My new email address is: rich.frye@icloud.com and new phone number is 773 577 3476