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frogfarm Wrote:People join forums, get jumped on for doing what they want not hurting anyone else, forums suffer lack of participation and wonder why, someone tells them and gets jumped on, makes sense to me.
When you know said forums don't like what "you want", find a forum that supports "your wants" otherwise don't bitch about something that you knew before hand.
Nothing like complaining about getting stung while you're smacking a bee hive.
So your saying your reactions are genetic, bred into you for millions of years to exclude people who aren't like you but aren't harming you?
If your rationalizing that's just the way it is and it'll never change then my talk is done.
swirlygig Wrote:Quote:Again Rusty is a shitty person.
Pot calling the kettle black. You keep 17 large darts in a 42 gallon space.
Edit: Good luck finding someone to buy your clown car.
frogfarm Wrote:So your saying your reactions are genetic, bred into you for millions of years to exclude people who aren't like you but aren't harming you?
If your rationalizing that's just the way it is and it'll never change then my talk is done.
Ummm what???
What reactions?
How the hell am I rationalizing? I'm pointing out facts. 90% of the online dart hobby is against hybrids. This person knew that! How can you get mad when you know before hand what people will say? That is like me trying to sell the satanic bible to church full of Christians and then i can't believe it when they don't like what I'm selling.
Am I allowed to call him out on having 17 tinc sized frogs in a 50 gallon? Or because it doesn't affect me I can't say anything?
Not quite the same thing but point taken.
You can say whatever you want, I just am saying how I view it and probably how others view it. Maybe that's why they aren't on line or lurk, intolerance.
Personally I wouldn't visit those forums for the above reason. Maybe that's why they are dwindeling.
Different? Yes, but the point is the same. If someone knows that the majority of the folks that are going to read your add are not going to approve of it , you better have thick skin.
the majority of people don't post on forums because they are lazy, and if they are so thin skinned as to not come back after 'harsh harsh harsh' treatment then they aren't probably going to be serious and stick with the hobby anyway. We welcome all viewpoints but don't expect coddling or handholding. This is a big boy (and girl) forum.
But the thing is that some do and if he sells them to someone who actually wants them, not to euthanize how can you really say how many are against hybridization. The ones who speak up do but the general consensus amongst animal keepers is they either don't mind them or want them as shown by the multitude of animals that are hybrid pets and the prices paid, so in general I think your neglecting the views of a lot of people who keep darts. All to keep lines pure that might not be pure in the first place and to eventually drive hybrids into the hobby for fear of showing them as hybrids. Do what you will though I could take them or leave them. I'm certainly not going to waste time trying to keep them from occuring or going underground. And that giant fantasticus looking hybrid looked kinda cool. How could anyone ever euthanize such an animal because of what it was born?Sell them as what they are and I fail to see a problem, would you euthanize an unknown for not being able to be in a breeding program? Why is this different does a hybrid cease to be a dart frog?
I think the 'euthanize' crowd is not as big as the anti-hybrid crowd. I think there are more people that would not kill them out of hand. Killing a large healthy animal is....not easy.
Again, I think they should be donated to a school or church or equivalent. With tight and binding assurances that they stay there and not get passed on to other people.
It's not the animal's fault.
Ghostvivs Wrote:Matter of fact I have an auratus that I don't know what it is, he will forever be alone and he will not leave his viv until he passes of old age.
If you werent worried about hybrids it wouldn't have to be alone. Oh well. At least he's able to be displayed or sold without people wanting to euthanize him and causing a scene.
Ghostvivs Wrote:Ghostvivs Wrote:Matter of fact I have an auratus that I don't know what it is, he will forever be alone and he will not leave his viv until he passes of old age.
Casper,
Your talk of how many frogs I have in my tank is pointless. I see breeders cramming frogs into tiny tanks and deli containers all the time. I don't see you picking on the pig farmers of the dart frog hobby? I understand what you are saying though and Yes I would prefer they had more room, but they don't. They are doing just fine because I have had them for years (all raised together) in that tank with minimal territory issues.
frogfarm Wrote:If you werent worried about hybrids it wouldn't have to be alone. Oh well. At least he's able to be displayed or sold without people wanting to euthanize him and causing a scene.
Ghostvivs Wrote:Ghostvivs Wrote:Matter of fact I have an auratus that I don't know what it is, he will forever be alone and he will not leave his viv until he passes of old age.
The key is he will never leave my house because I don't know what it is.
swirlygig Wrote:Casper,
Your talk of how many frogs I have in my tank is pointless. I see breeders cramming frogs into tiny tanks and deli containers all the time. I don't see you picking on the pig farmers of the dart frog hobby? I understand what you are saying though and Yes I would prefer they had more room, but they don't. They are doing just fine because I have had them for years (all raised together) in that tank with minimal territory issues.
It is pointless because other people do it? That's a childrens argument when they get caught doing something they should not be.
Well Joe blow does it so I can...
Deli containers??? So displaying frogs for a weekend is the same thing? Right...
Apparently you don't know my track record of calling out BS.
Philsuma Wrote:the majority of people don't post on forums because they are lazy, and if they are so thin skinned as to not come back after 'harsh harsh harsh' treatment then they aren't probably going to be serious and stick with the hobby anyway. We welcome all viewpoints but don't expect coddling or handholding. This is a big boy (and girl) forum.
Lazy has relatively nothing to do with posting. Most people want to enjoy their hobbies. Why would they post into a forum that continually has a negative tone. Sure there is a lot of good information sprinkled in between all the ranting and yelling and name calling and that is why a lot of people lurk and never or rarely post. I check the site daily but over the past year have chosen to stay out of the arguing and answer emails and PM's from the underground. Sure some people are thin skinned but thick or thin who wants to be yelled at because of a hobby?
The people that are 'yelled at' at VERY few in number....less than 5% IMO.
This is a LIVE animal hobby with some passionate people on various ends of the entire spectrum. If it was all 'Kumbaya" and pattie cakes, then I highly doubt it would be effective. I think the entire forum works well -does it's job helping the animals, the hobby and the hobbyists. There is no societal 'Nirvana" to be had...impossible.
jellyman Wrote:I check the site daily but over the past year have chosen to stay out of the arguing and answer emails and PM's from the underground. Sure some people are thin skinned but thick or thin who wants to be yelled at because of a hobby?
There are "undergrounds" in every hobby. That is until said underground becomes profitable. Just look at all the folks that jump in thinking they are going to get rich selling darts. All it takes is two or three people to get a "lightbulb moment" thinking they are going to corner the new hybrid market and poof... we are now just like the python hobby.
Personally I want it to stay underground.
Do I think less of folks because they make hybrids? Nope, but don't expect me to not point out BS and please don't take my questions as yelling at folks. They may be blunt but they're just questions.
The 'Hybrid Underground'...dude come on! That's just ridiculous. Anyone that's been in the hobby for 3 plus years knows there is no such thing. You MAY get an odd PM or two and that's about it.
THIS is the exact reason Washcer and son will fail. This hobby does not (somehow) 'work' with producing hybrids and the silly false inflated market that follows like that pyramid scam Ball Python crap. It just doesn't WORK with frogs, and I'm glad...
5 people count as an underground... :wink:
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